Hi all,

       We built (dug) a koi-pond this summer.  So in anticipation for the Chicago winter, he went out and bought a heater to keep the fish alive.  We searched the internet purchased a heater from this place --> http://www.aquabead.com/thermakoi_heaters.htm

       After hooking up the heater per the directions, and plenty of cold days, we have determined that the heater is not heating.  We've easily determined this by taking the temp of the water at the point of the pump intake, and comparing it to the temp of the output (after the heater).  Both are the same readings whether the heat light is on or off.  The light is on to signal the heat cycle is on.  The temp setting is set to about 5 degrees above current water temp.  Well my son has gone back and forth with the company via e-mail, and only after a month has finally spoken to someone on the phone.  They suggested covering the pond.  ...apparently not understanding that our static test shows that it's not working.  So they have agreed that we can send it back for testing.  So it goes back tomorrow.

     So I have a couple of questions for those of you out there...  Does anyone out there have one of these (or other) heaters.  Also, can you plainly tell that it is heating the water???  I would expect an increase of at least a couple of degrees at the ouput of the heater.  I do have the thermostat set to 5 degrees above current water temp.  The unit doesn't get "warm" either. 

     I do realize that when comes to the "big-picture" that a heater's efficiency is based upon outside temp, size of pond, and thought-put of the pump, etc.

            Thanks,

                      Mark

Dtrain; just a random thought. How much water does the pump push (gpm)? if the water does not slow down going through the heater it may take a while to notice the water being heated. free flow through a heating device will not really show a difference quickly. I have worked in the apartment industry for years, pool heaters take several days to make a difference in water temp, electric heaters take even longer to show a rise in temp.

Gregg M. (Seabeck, WA) 18 years of fix'n

Mark,

 

It may be too late to bring this up, since the heater is going back to manufacturer tomorrow.  It should be quite easy to determine if an electric heater is putting energy (heat) into the water or not.  Simply put a clamp-on ammeter on one of the incoming wires and operate it both with it calling for heat (indicator light on) and not calling for heat.  If there is a difference, that difference must represent energy going to the heating element.  The voltage times the current difference will tell you how many watts are being put into heating the water.

 

Bob Hoyer ...... Bremerton, WA

The pond folks I know turn their pumps off in winter. I do the same. My koi pond was about 3' at deepest point and Oranda ponds 18" deep. Coldest part of winter had 3" of ice so they had lots of "wet" water to sleep in. Yes my fish hibernated. You need to stop feeding as the weather gets cold. They just lay near the bottom and sleep. If you are worried about amonia and other bad things (they don't do that much while they sleep) we have set an immersion heater like for a cup of tea on top. A 2" hole down to water is plenty for off gassing. Also you can tie a line to a metal pot and fill it with very hot water until it melt through. Don't worry too much about them. When spring comes fish wake up slowly and are fine, just don't feed them too soon. One BAD thing. My kids were worried about fish breathing with ice covered pond. So they pounded holes in the ice!!! The shock waves were like a depth charge and killed them. Randy
Try to keep all body parts attached

The folks I know around here take their fish out of the pond for winter and put then in a large tank (like a small livestock watering tank, depending on the number and size of the fish) and over winter them in the basement that way. A small pond can freeze soild when we get the below zero stretch. The frost line can easily go to 3' below ground in a bad winter.

--
>Click to learn more about me The Wood Wizard
SE Wisconsin
Member since 2000

Hi Mark,

IMHO, it's impossible to heat the whole pond. If you really want to do this, give me a head's up on your utility company's name so I can buy stock in it.

If you want to keep it running all winter, you need a really deep pond. If you intend on keeping it running with a heater, you're gonna go broke.

Seriously now.......

I have had a doughnut like heater for several winters. The principal behind this heater is to keep the ice dissolved in the center of the doughnut. This allows an opening in the ice for gasses to escape.
But the pond must be deep enough for the fish to go into semi-hibernation at the bottom. Mine is about 30 inches deep in one part that is about the size of a bathtub. I have the heater over this area.
Of course, I remove the pump for the winter and clean it, store it submerged in a tall 6 gallon pail to keep the rubber seals in it from drying out. I just removed and cleaned it today. I also removed the small fountain type pump that I run through a UV light. Oh, the light also came in for the winter. I'll clean the small pump and the UV light tomorrow.

I live in Northeastern Pennsylvania and our winters may be as bad as yours sometimes. Last year the ice on my pond easily supported my weight and was about eight inches thick. All my goldfish made it through the winter, in the spring my two koi came down with something and died. But they made it through the previous winter just fine.

Some pictures of my pond can be seen here: http://www.ourpage.com/pond2/

Now for a more detailed post I made last year in this forum on Pre-Winterizing my pond, http://handymanclub.com/community/f...mp;t=36732">click here.

EDIT:
Attached are two images of the heater in my pond under the snow and netting covering my pond taken and added today, December, 09, 2009.


This community is the sum of of the knowledge of all.
Only we must communicate that knowledge to each other via this forum.
Participate, Teach and Learn.

Cordially,
Gerry

Hi,

     Yes, I do agree that heating the whole pond is impossible.  ...but the son has a job (and his own money).  So he bought the heater.

     As it turns out, he sent it back and they claim that it works.  Well my wife got on the phone with them and basically said that for $800, the heater should be increasing the water temperature (at the output point of the heater) by something.  This thing did nothing!  He kept saying that we need to cover the pond (which we understand), never listening to her that there was no temperature change across the heater!  So she finally broke him and he said that he would issue a refund.  But we haven't seen it yet and it's been a week. 

     Thanks!

        Mark

 

 

 

 

Good for Her and Good Luck.
Sometimes pond places are very slow.
Always use a credit card with pond places.
I ordered 50 lbs of charcoal in early April and after calling my credit card company in late May, to put a hold on payment, it came in mid June.
Just before the last snow I saw all of my fish nosing around under the ice. The gold fish are rather large, about eight inches so it was easy to spot them under the ice.





This community is the sum of the knowledge of all.
Only we must communicate that knowledge to each other via this forum.
Participate, Teach and Learn.

Cordially,
Gerry

I have had a Koi pond for 4 years now and still learning, but the Koi do hibernate during the winter months.  I am in Ohio, just a little north of Columbus.  My pond gradually goes to a 4 ft. depth to give my koi a good hibernating depth; and I have not had a problem for the fish for two years now.  The biggest problem I have had was not enough oxygen creating plants for the summer months;  and a lot of algae build up.  I actually lost 18 Koi my first year because i did not have enough plant life in the pond.  Now that i have the plant life i have  taken care of  that problem.  I have left a small fountain running through out the winter and not had a problem.  It just gets prettier with the ice build up at it edges.  Depth  of your pond is the key here; for the koi to hibernate in .  My koi pond it 14' x 20', and goes from 8 inches down to 4 feet the length of the  pond.

Dtrain,

Have you thought about using an aerator for the pond.  http://www.pondmerchant.com/home/po...html  This link will show you some small aerators for overwintering  a small pond.  They seem to be inexpensive and I know they work for stock tanks.

WNY has 2 seasons: Winter and construction. Mike H.

Dtrain

 For $800.00 should be a hot tub!!!

 All a pond needs in Chicago Metro is to keep a hole in the ice.............

 For over 15 years have had my share of pond heaters 1500 watt to this 100 watt the best one.

 Now in its 3rd year and I paid under $60.00........

 Your expectations for the heater may have been influenced by the price.

 BEWARE OF THIS BEING A NEWBIE TO THE POND WORLD........

The need to shop around is a must the Pond Shops are going to take advantage.

 Case in point a $800.00 pond heater.

Keep the pump on, moving water freezes last if at all.

 Not to mention here in chi-town if it feeds a waterfall it sure is breath taken......  

K&H FLOATING POND HEATER 100-WATT

Stop The Cry'n and Do Some Try'n Geneva IL. Member Since 1998

I have exactly what ScooterDown mentioned.
The only caution is that I use something across my pond and wire-tie the power cord to it as if it tips over, it ain't totally waterproof.
Friend of mind went through at least four of them.
Yep. they let the cord dip down and it tipped it enough for water to enter through the cord grommet.

I'm still on my first one and it works like a champ.

This community is the sum of the knowledge of all.
Only we must communicate that knowledge to each other via this forum.
Participate, Teach and Learn.

Cordially,
Gerry

hey Mark, The simplest is the best. http://www.deanbennett.com/livestoc...eaters.htm at the farm I was working we use the floating water heater on the pound for our cows and it keeped it open all winter long!! try them and they realy works. RPH
-----------------------------------------------------------
R.P.Hagge is my name. I'm known as The RealBigSwede on the net. I'm a handyman at home and one time my company: The Handyman! special to fix other screwup! I did help people with old and historic houses. Living now in a 1899-1900 old house! Me and my wife is fixing it up!.

Dtrain

If you have a pond liner or plastic insert the heaters @ this web site would be a problem.

 I had the float /no float it would pop the GFCI .

The high wattage on them is not necessary.

 My K&H heater has failed after that rain we had last week.

 It's keeping a hole in the ice so is the pond light.

 In the winter have it pointing up.

 It also gives off steamy fog.

 Very cool! and that is only 35 watts.

 The pumps running the water fall is iced and flowing.

 Its great to have a pond in the winter..................................
    
  http://www.deanbennett.com/livestoc...nkheaters.





Stop The Cry'n and Do Some Try'n Geneva IL. Member Since 1998

Gerry_D

Guess what!

I also will be keeping the power cord tied. Was blowing the GFCI.

ScooterDown,
I made through the winter w/o any problems.
All my fish survived and are doing well.
I should take a picture or two.

Gerry_D

My fish survived also!!

Frog and toads too!!

Heater kept a hole in the ice.

I'll admit I don't know ANYTHING about pond or KOI or fish stuff, but here's an idea to try. How about if you decide to re-build' what about putting aheating element under the whole thing in the first place,something like the ones you would put under a sidewalk or driveway to keep it warn enoughto melt any snow or ice. I've put hem in my sidewalks, and hooked them up to a thermostat with a manual switch to shut it off during the warmer times of the year. Il live in central-eastern PA.
it gets plenty cold here too.You should see the look on the faces of my neighbors when they DON'T see me shoveling!!! MUSKIE

I've never used a pond heater, my Koi and goldfish have always survived the winter weather here. In case of a deep freeze, I simply punch a hole in the ice once in a while and have had no problems with dead fish in the spring. My ponds are quite shallow compared to many others, about 20" to 24" deep.

muskie

What would be the cost psf ?

Dewey

I'm 60 miles west of ChiTown have same pond depth as you if no heater would freeze solid......

Where are you?